Feature request for Edit Entries page

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 2:45 pm

Hi,

I was wondering about the following:

On the edit Entries page you have options to "view", "edit" or "delete" an entry.

However, if you have an article that is in draft mode (saved) or "scheduled" to appear in the future, you can not use the "view" option because it will simply tell you that the article does not exist.

I would suggest that when you click such an article (i.e. that has status "draft" or is scheduled to show up in the future) you get to see the preview, just as you do when editing it.

This would be very nice to just have a quick preview without going to edit mode....

Post by **garvinhicking** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 8:18 pm

Hi!

Hm, executing the preview would then also lead into the "Edit" screen of the entry. If you think that's fine, I could implement that. Note that I could patch it so that a preview would be shown imemdiately, but underneath it having the edit section.

If you think the edit screen would "suck", I could offer to remove the "View" button for draft-entries.

Displaying a preview without executing the edit-entry would mean a 50% rewrite of the preview functionality. Since the preview is currently finally getting stable, I'd better not like to redo that piece for the little benefit it has...?

stm999999999 · Post by **stm999999999** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:54 pm

I would prefer "preview with edit section"

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:08 pm

stm999999999 wrote:I would prefer "preview with edit section"

Uh, why not just go to edit then? That kind of defies the purpose of the "view" button???

I understand the problem and I do not want to cause any unnessecary work (If it ain't broke etc..).

(Pre)Viewing an article is something different than going in edit mode and looking at it: that's why we have the "edit" button.

The idea was/is to be able to see (preview) an article that is not yet published (hence the "view" icon)...

Maybe it's easier to NOT show the view icon then at articles that are in the future or that are still in editing....

I rather have that actually, because at least there is a good reason for it not to show.

The reason I came up with this remark in the first place is from a usability point of view: the backend shows and option that turns out not to work in certain cases.

So usability dictates: a) make it work the way it is expected (i.e. show the preview/article) OR b) don't show it (the "view" option) cause it doesn't work in this scenario... But do not mix two options...

Am I making any sense here? Or am I just being to critical because I believe that usability is key and distinguishes a good product from a less good product? I am open to debate

Post by **garvinhicking** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:00 pm

Hi hgoor!

I really meant that a "Preview" button WOULD show the preview on top, but the entry editing section below. So not only the same functionality as with the edit button, but rather the same functionality than clicking "edit" and then clicking "preview".

HTH,
Garvin

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:21 pm

garvinhicking wrote:Hi hgoor!

I really meant that a "Preview" button WOULD show the preview on top, but the entry editing section below. So not only the same functionality as with the edit button, but rather the same functionality than clicking "edit" and then clicking "preview".

HTH,
Garvin

Oh, I understood that fully: but that's like a combination of "edit" and "view" and that is not the exepected behaviour from a button called "view"

One of the first things about usability is that giving functions the right name and the expected behaviour is pretty important...

So the right name for that would be: "view/edit" not just not "view" only and then when you do that the "edit" function looses its function actually...

Don't get me wrong: from a coder/developers position it might sound good and logical, but that would really be a usability nono...

So as I said, imho, the best option altogether (for now) would be to not show the view option at such articles, because obviously it was not meant to be (pre)viewed from there except after going in edit-mode....

I rather see it in a later version (1.5 ??) and then behave the way it should than have some option now that goes against common usability sense...

But once again: that is just my opinion.

For more about usability/GUI etc.. I recommend these urls.. Usually its very enlightning for coders/programmers:

http://www.usability.gov/pdfs/guidelines.html
http://www.digital-web.com/articles/use ... h_the_bad/
http://www.37signals.com/svn/
http://www.nateklaiber.com/
http://www.guuui.com/

Or, basically:

http://del.icio.us/search/?fr=del_icio_ ... y&type=all

Post by **garvinhicking** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:33 am

Hi!

Oh, I understood that fully: but that's like a combination of "edit" and "view" and that is not the exepected behaviour from a button called "view" ]

How about labeling normal entries with "View" and drafted ones with "Preview"? Then those people would get a preview with the edit window they also know from editing entries?

Thanks for the links, I'll take a look at these!

Best regards,
Garvin

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:32 pm

garvinhicking wrote:How about labeling normal entries with "View" and drafted ones with "Preview"? Then those people would get a preview with the edit window they also know from editing entries?

Thanks for the links, I'll take a look at these!

Best regards,
Garvin

Haha. Well, even though that name would be more appropriate ("view" vs "preview") it still would be a combination of functions.

I firmly believe that offering a (pre)view together with the Edit function means that the "Edit" button has become obsolete; why use it?

Also: what are you going to do within that page? You show the article and have the edit function below it.

So, just like on the edit page (correction: you are on the edit page, except I got there using a button called "preview"?) there will be yet another "preview" function there as well? I mean, if you edit something, you need to be able to (pre)view it (again)?

As you said in your initial response:

garvinhicking wrote:If you think the edit screen would "suck", I could offer to remove the "View" button for draft-entries.

Let's face it, the ONLY reason NOT to do it:

garvinhicking wrote:Displaying a preview without executing the edit-entry would mean a 50% rewrite of the preview functionality. Since the preview is currently finally getting stable, I'd better not like to redo that piece for the little benefit it has...?

So I think it remains the best and only logical option at the moment until you think its worth bothering with the code as you mention (maybe for a new release of S9y).

Although being a non-technical person I do not understand why this view is different from the other (pre)view. You show the same thing except you leave out the edit part?

Post by **garvinhicking** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:59 am

Hi!

The technical trouble of the preview is that it runs in an iframe and can only take the input from session data. To put the entry data into a session would require to POST the entry data first somewhere, or to fetch it on a transfer page and then redirect to a new one.

I'll try to see how the redirection stuff could happen next week, maybe it'S not as hard as I imagine it to be.

Note that in the next months we'll be getting professional Usability Engineer support from openusability.org to work on the serendipity entry creation interface. I'm sure many things that should please you will happen there

Best regards,
Garvin

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 1:51 pm

garvinhicking wrote:Note that in the next months we'll be getting professional Usability Engineer support from openusability.org to work on the serendipity entry creation interface. I'm sure many things that should please you will happen there
Best regards,
Garvin

Hi Garvin,

That sounds really good. S9y is a good system already and I'm sure there will be many suggestions to make it even better!

I'll be waiting to see how things progress!

Regards,

Henk

Post by **garvinhicking** » Sun Jan 14, 2007 5:06 pm

Hi!

I just committed the preview feature to the s9y nightlies (version 1.2) where it should be contained starting tomorrow.

It seems to work great

(Even though it was an hour worth of coding and debugging, I think it's well spent)

Best regards,
Garvin

hgoor · Post by **hgoor** » Sun Jan 14, 2007 5:25 pm

garvinhicking wrote:Hi!

I just committed the preview feature to the s9y nightlies (version 1.2) where it should be contained starting tomorrow.

It seems to work great

(Even though it was an hour worth of coding and debugging, I think it's well spent)

Best regards,
Garvin

Sounds good!

Guess I will have install that then on my test machine

Thanks for the effort (as usual!)

Feature request for Edit Entries page

Feature request for Edit Entries page

Re: Feature request for Edit Entries page